While I was at the recent ill-fated train show/swap meet, I had time to review all that was on my swap table. I pulled out three old kits for further review= and pulled back two of them. One of ths was this topic's kit. I really don't need a vinegar works. I need grain elevators, feed elevators, etc. But then I took a hard look at the "vat building". Hmmm. Looks a bit like a grain elevator. Eureka!
Now, if I can merge the vat building with the main building, then I'm in business.
This is the typical BiS kit, with large elevations and detail views and each build section in a separate bag. In this one, there is a plaster base for the main building, cast vats, and an office building foundation.
It was a simple task of making copies of the plans, cut out each wall section, spray adhesive on some heavy duty card board, and make up the main building. I did the same for the clerestory portion of the vat building to see I like the potential looks. And I do.
I then mocked up the elevator section to check on proportions and overall look. But of course, I failed to account for the sloping roof and this will have to be redone. But I like what I am seeing. I had to make an area for the drive-through scale and grain dump.
So, first thing is to start on the main building as everything else comes from it's configuration. This is a but quirky, but the various wall openings are outlined by saw cuts. There is no wall piece identification, so one has to pick a piece and see if it fits somewhere. If it does, label the wall number on the back and fine the next piece and repeat.
I'll use a brass brush to each wall piece to bring the grain out a bit and then hit the wall with the pounce wheel for nail holes.
The bag contains bunch of strip wood and each piece only get identified by reading through each construction step. Buried in the bunch is some internal bracing, but I couldn't quickly find it. No doubt it'll be replaced some more robust strip wood anyway. That and the whole lot will be give an A&I bath, so I may wind up with some unused bits and pieces.
Looks like a fun project. Of course I'll be following.
Very interesting building Bob.....I'll be looking in on this one. :)
Hey Bob:
Looks like you are off to A good start. I shall be following along.
Karl
Glad you may find this interesting. This will be slow going.
I got the pounce wheel going and got the nail holes in the walls. Then there is the matter of the upper wall sections. As shown previously, window and door openings are marked with saw cuts. This means the top of the windows are at the top of the wall pieces. So, there is 3 pieces of 1/4" tall material to finish off the wall height. And they want one to continue the nail holes up on these piece as well. This required me to find the corner wall trim and inside corner post pieces to accurately place this 1/4" piece on each wall section and hit them with the pounce wheel.
I also needed to read the instructions to pick out what cut strip wood goes where and what needs an A&I and which ones don't. In the end, I decided to pretty much give just about everything in the bath.
One thing about BiS kits, they try to make building each section easy by pre-cutting all the strip wood. And to some it extent it works. But when there are over a dozen different sizes of material to figure out what goes where, it can get a bit overwhelming.
Great project! I'll be following along.
I'll certainly be following along, Bob. No hurry needed--I enjoy watching it slowly take shape.
I have a fondness for BiS kits--the second craftsman kit I ever attempted was "The Waterfront" way back when it was a new release. Gave it away back in the 80s (I think it was) when I dismantled my trains in favor of married life and raising kids. When I resurrected my layout I bought it again on eBay a few years back. I really appreciate the full scale plans, very detailed instructions, parts in individual bags, and all those castings!
I really like your approach with the mockups, careful planning, and etc. Can't wait to see this one take shape.
--Opa George
Bob,
Will follow along...
Tommy
Included was a nice plaster foundation. It has a raised area to hold the main building when assembled. Considering how soft it is, I'm amazed that it is still in one piece considering the amount of moves that it has been through.
Also included are some cast plaster vats. I don't know why, but only two of them form a set. None of the other pieces come close to making a single piece. But then, if built into the vat house, one wouldn't notice the mis-matched tops. I looking at using these on the interior of the main building and leaving a set of sliding doors open.
The wall pieces were given the A&I wash. Even with doing both sides and weighing down overnight, there was some warping. Nothing that can't be flattened. But before bracing, I need to add the outside corner trim as they are added to each wall piece laying flat and face up. Which means that I need to decide on a color scheme overnight.
Hey Bob:
Looks like you are progressing.
Karl
This has been real slow going as of late.
On top of each 1/16" thick wall was a piece of 1/32 trim. Talk about a delicate joint. In the photo, these pieces are just sitting in place and the nail holes show the need to correctly apply them. The needed metal casting have been found and due for an ultrasonic bath. The sliding doors are really thick as there is detail on both sides.
Next up is the interior bracing. The stained pieces are what was supplied and the plain piece is what I'll be using. Since the bracing is required to be a specific length, here was a good place to break out the micro saw and cutting channel. I should note that there was no provision for corner glue pieces, so those were added as well.
I wanted to due a sponge paint job, but it quickly failed and I decided to punt and do a quick stain instead. So, white over black gets a grey. Not what I want. So a quick rub of Pan Pastel white and I'm back in business. You can see the difference in the bigger panel that hasn't been given an of th4 Pan Pastel white. The plan view shows where the corner trim will go and the new corner bracing.
Glazing is old school, with a cut diagram for each window type. It is a simple matter of taping the upper edge of the acetate and cut away. There is more than enough material provided.
One thing that is helping, is going through the instructions and then pulling out need material for each step and place them in a labeled bag. So here, all material for steps J5 and J 6 are readily available.
Hey Bob:
Looks like you are making good progress. Can't wait for more.
Karl
Well. life's little detours have been getting in the way, but we'll push on as time permits. And if I can't work on this kit, at least I can think of options and what's next.
With all the wall's ins and outs, I'm really glad that I made a mock up. Before I get the building closed in, I need to add some horizontal bracing for adding a first or second floor. Of course all the vertical bracing is now in the way. The three Ps have struck again.
One of the things that have been on my nerves is the thickness of the sliding doors. These are to be set flush with the walls and the heft is apparent. They would have been okay if the door openings were to be cut out. But they weren't. So, I'll just make some from scratch. Scribed siding and 1x 8's and 4's and I should be good to go.
Then there is the matter of the second floor office expansion. Normally, a decent enough feature, having 2x4 walls being built and all. They even included the office furniture and a diagram of placement. Nope. Ain't goin' to do it. I'll make a stand alone office. Of course, now I have to make a wall where if my three Ps fault hadn't reared it's ugly head. The last photo shows the area in question and the building photo showing an open office wall. I have other plans for the first floor bump out.
Looking good, Bob.
I agree with your decision to remake those sliders. I do mine on low take painters tape, stuck sticky side up on my workbench. I put the 6x1" (or 8x1") boards with slight gaps between them. After gluing on the 4x1" framing and cross braces on you can remove the tape. As I discovered, when you light the inside you get lovely very prototypical shafts of light shining through the gaps in the doors.
Photo towards the bottom of page 21.
http://modelersforum.com/index.php?topic=4484.300
Cheers, Mark.
Quote from: Mark Dalrymple on November 21, 2021, 11:07:19 PM
Looking good, Bob.
I agree with your decision to remake those sliders. I do mine on low take painters tape, stuck sticky side up on my workbench. I put the 6x1" (or 8x1") boards with slight gaps between them. After gluing on the 4x1" framing and cross braces on you can remove the tape. As I discovered, when you light the inside you get lovely very prototypical shafts of light shining through the gaps in the doors.
Photo towards the bottom of page 21.
http://modelersforum.com/index.php?topic=4484.300 (http://modelersforum.com/index.php?topic=4484.300)
Cheers, Mark.
How in the . . . . did I miss that photo? I'll have to remember that. Currently the doors will just sit on the walls, thus the one sided approach. But for doors being a bit open, those look really good.
Hey Bob:
Walls looks great so far. Can't wait to see more.
Karl
Spent a bit of time to make my own sliding doors. Basically, it was a simple matter of copying the kit doors, but thinner. I was able to use slightly different materials for the sliding door brackets.
The plan was to make and install the three sliders before attaching the building to the base. But, . . . there is to be a 2x6 wood loading dock deck, so I need to add the building first, then I can add the doors.
The main building wound up being three sub assemblies. And a quick check of alignment, using the roof card, showed a problem with the building. Not so sure how, it could be that far off, using all precut wall sections. Oh well. At least there is a second floor car that I wasn't going to use. I'll just need to make a template and cut it out for the roof.
With the building glued in place, I added the wood for the loading docks. The vertical pencil line is the center line of the single set of sliding doors.
While waiting for the building-to-base glue to set, I gave some attention to what was to be a scale house, but will be an attached office/scale house on the new elevator section.
The kit include a bunch of office furniture which may be used here.
The original office layout included space that was to be under construction. The scale house is small. only 5.2 cm deep. Luckily, BiS B&B siding is a match to some that I have on hand. So I'll just scab on a new section on each side to lengthen it.
The scale was made on top of a copy of the template, mainly to hold the cross way 2x8 boards to the frame. The kit includes a hatch which is perfect for apples, not so much for grain. I'll make a set of bars across where the hatch would be located for grain unloading.
I did a quick look to how the elevator portion will look. It will have a rock foundation and perhaps corrugated metal siding. I will use the clerestory portion from the original vat house. Except after looking at it, I need to double it's width. It's a bit on the skinny side now. The kit included a roof deck access bit, that I'll add to the end of clerestory.
Nice progress on this kit, Bob. I like your variations--adds lots of interest.
--Opa George
Looks great so far. Strange about the roof because everything looks square.
To fix the roof card, I placed the original in place and went around the edges with Post-it notes. This gave me an almost exact template to follow. The replacement deck was cit from material provided for a second floor card.
I found a short piece of matching B&B material and gave it a bath if A&I. Then it was a matter of taping the scale house walls together to get an idea of how it would look. Because it is small, I wanted to lengthen it a bit. Nope don't like it. I was at a seed mill and they had a plant office attached to a side. Move some parts around to get a better visual, and yeah. I like this orientation better. It means that it'll have to be scratch built, but I like how this looks.
Shaping up well Bob..... 8)
Slowly taking shape. First shot is of the "road side" with the new office section and a visual of the head house. I did spend a bit of time on adding an interior of the scale bay. No real reason and the areas would be hard to see, but I know it's there.
Was using Micro-Marks new corner post material and thought that I was messing them up some how. Well, that might be true, however the 1/16" material is not reversible. If you look closely, the left hand corner is recessed from the material face whereas the right side is even. The profile is off a bit. One must pick an orientation and stick to it. Since this will be covered with metal, it really doesn't matter, although this could affect overall lengths.
I do like Monster Model Works brick and block sheets and I found using the Mt Albert sander a real boon in achieving decent corners. Simple matter of setting up for a 45 degree sand and use a machinist's block to keep the material vertical.
As I mentioned, I am going to cover the left hand building with corrugated aluminum sheet. I had a large inventory when I move and it is slowly going down. I guess I shouldn't have been all that surprised to learn that replacement stock cost raised a bit over time. My old stock had a $1.35 price tag and for the same quantity it is now $9.35.
I read where it was recommended to use a primer enchant spray paint. So I got some in gray, but looks a bit gray-green. But it does offer some tooth and harder to remove.
I did a bit of testing with paint, titanium white powder, and white Pan Pastels. I'll stick with the paint as a base cost. I'll be painting the entire material length and then cutting them into 2" widths. I can see where kit manufacturers take into account wall heights and roof depths in order to get the best and most economical use of material. I haven't. Sigh.
So here is where I am at. I have the head house built up and windows opening cut out. And everything just sitting together. Next up is making roof decking.
I should mention that I am using a 1/16" plywood material. I cuts decently. But has some delaminating issues here and there where cuts occur close to an edge like in the head house.
You making great progress.
I guess it is typical for me; one step forward and two steps back. I spent some amount of time looking at lighting the building. A bit late. Heck, way too late. but I'll give it a shot. I made up a second floor card since I used the one provided for the roof. It took a bunch of fiddling since I braced the heck out of the structure. I didn't paint the inside for lighting, but that shouldn't be such a big deal, but then it occurred to me that the walls had a bunch of vertical joints and these would leak light like crazy. Oh well, Maybe light just the office.
I started to add the siding, but first needed to add some vertical guidelines to add in their placement. Then a quick look at how everything is coming together. Then another look with a interior stairway.
To continue with the siding, I need to get the office section attached. I found some old wall paper from Sierra Railroad products and got it attached to all walls. Then get the office furniture made and painted. I did the same for the cheap figures that'll be used.
Now it is a matter of finishing and installing the ceiling and then I can add the office portion to the storage building.
Great modeling Bob. Love the interior.
Lots of progress, Bob!
Things are really taking shape nicely. The doors came up well. I like that technique of painting and weathering the stripwood and then assembling the doors. Using two colours you can achieve a very convincing paintjob. Your corrugated iron in white looks very good, too. Some nice interior detail - worth the extra effort. It sounds like these old BIS kits come with a good amount of details. I have the Silverado mine tucked away for a future build.
Cheers, Mark.
Bob
I just got caught up with your thread - great modeling - love the repurposing of the structure.
Someone asked (on Facebook) "what wood should I have to build craftsman kits?" Here's the list I came up with: scale 1x6, 2x6. 1/32 square, 1/32 x 1/16, 1/16 square, 1/8 square. The latter is for additional bracing. Then I thought, "It would be good if some vendor came up with a starter kit that had 3-4 pieces of each of those sizes in a single package."
dave
QuoteSomeone asked (on Facebook) "what wood should I have to build craftsman kits?"
One would have thought everything needed would be supplied?
Dave - you lost me a bit when you swapped from scale inches to imperial, but...1/32 seems like an odd measurement? That's a little less than scale 3x3? I'd certainly put 4x4's on the list...
Cheers, Mark.
Quote from: Mark Dalrymple on January 01, 2022, 08:03:40 PM
Lots of progress, Bob!
Things are really taking shape nicely. The doors came up well. I like that technique of painting and weathering the stripwood and then assembling the doors. Using two colours you can achieve a very convincing paintjob. Your corrugated iron in white looks very good, too. Some nice interior detail - worth the extra effort. It sounds like these old BIS kits come with a good amount of details. I have the Silverado mine tucked away for a future build.
Cheers, Mark.
Yes, they did (do). I met Jim when he first started to produce the kits and bought several over the years. When he had a kit that I didn't really care for, I bought a bunch of detail parts. He was to produce a mine, but he didn't get the chance to get it out. The instructions are a mixed bag. Each step details what parts are needed, but one has to cross reference with either illustrations further on in the instructions or one of the detail sheets. If you are one wanting to do an application of A&I, you have to read ALL the instructions and pick out the pieces to be weathered.
I bought some cheap pre-painted figures from Asia and each needs to be repainted, but they are a decent starting point, especially for interiors.
Quote from: Mark Dalrymple on January 02, 2022, 02:52:25 PM
QuoteSomeone asked (on Facebook) "what wood should I have to build craftsman kits?"
One would have thought everything needed would be supplied?
Dave - you lost me a bit when you swapped from scale inches to imperial, but...1/32 seems like an odd measurement? That's a little less than scale 3x3? I'd certainly put 4x4's on the list...
Cheers, Mark.
I'm wondering if the person was curious as to extra wood that might be needed? And all mentioned would be appropriate. But then I have some of just about all sizes available. I've added some 5/32 square for bracing in certain areas as well.
The main building has a truck dock with a canopy. They provide very nice cast supports, sad that they won't be seen. The instructions have one add two 2x6"s to hold the metal roofing. From my experience, this won't be enough, so I added three boards. The white painted one was scavenged from my 2x6 bin. I made a couple of patterns to cut out the metal and then installed the roofing. Not my best work, but serviceable.
I am liking the self etching primer. One can still scratch thru the paint layer, but it is a bit harder. The metal has three coats of white craft paint. The flashing, is heavy duty aluminum foil, cut the a scale width of 1 foot. It is them placed against a straight edge, and the center bent up a bit. I really like how this looks.
I have decided to add some exterior lighting. So, I'm making my own using Campbell shades, 1.4mm tubing, and 0402 SMD leds.
I'm really liking the proportions of this section.
I found cutting the roofing metal went better but adding some painters tape to the bottom of my cutting edge. Then place the metal against a straight edge as it has a tendency to bend. Then cut the material starting at about the center and work to each end.
I found that 1.4mm tubing will slide in the bezel of the Campbell shade. Then it is a matter of soldering the two together and clean up the joint. The one must first clean up any cut ends and after soldering, ream out the holes on the end. Admittedly, I got waaaaay ahead of my self and made the bends using wire looping pliers. I learned real quick that feeding the wires past the bends wasn't going to happen. So more cutting and cleaning and soldering and using straight tubing pieces, feed the wires through. I used the pancake battery to test the leds. Feeding the wires takes a bunch of patience. I found it best to feed one wire partially through, then get the other wire in and while slowly turning the brass tube slowly feed the wires through. The wires might form more of a knot, if so, back them out and try again. I should mention that with these teeny leds, I fortified the solder joint with a drop of Canopy glue. Before pulling the wires tight, I added more Canopy glue to hold the leds in place. These have been primed, so I didn't photograph them yet.
Excellent Bob.
hey Bob:
Looking good so far. Can't wait to see more.
Karl
I got all the lamps primed and painted. I'm only going to use 3 of these for this build.
I added some 1/8" blocking behind where they will be placed to give a bit more support than a 1/16" piece of wood can. In the future, I hope to do this prior to assembly of the building.
To my eye these give out decent light at 3 volts.
I wanted to check on the actual resistance of the resistors that came with these lights. That and determine the resistance of the LEDS. My multimeter must be off as I can't get it to read much of anything. Although apparently I am generating 13 millivolts DC. Well, it varied between 13 and 6 millivolts.
Hey Bob:
Lamps look great. Isn't it fun bending all those wires and they even light up. Great job can't wait to see more.
Karl
I love the added dimension that lighting the structures gives the layout, but still haven't figured it all out..... ::)
Looks great.
I ran into a bit of a snag. I recently bought some more brown spray paint for my ground cover base making sure it wasn't a gloss. Matte seems a decent option. I measured out my foam core base, got it spray painted, marked off building placement, and cut out areas for access to the LED wiring. I add additional 1/2" strips around the perimeter for bus wiring. I got the grain section glued on and after drying overnight. Then I tilted the base on it's side to pull out the internal wires and . . . the building slid off the base! Luckily, my desk is a bit messy so it didn't go far or hard. So now it was a matter of figuring out how to save what I had. Seems the Matte paint was a bit too glossy. Nothing would stick to it decently. I did find that if I did an over spray of a matte varnish, I could get Canopy and Elmers glue to hold.
Now I can finally add the buildings. First up the grain building. I needed to make and install a set of steps for the door and then add some gravel now as later, it''l be a royal pain to do so.
Then the mill portion was added with the stair housing. Now I can start to add all the extra building bits and bobs. Then the plan is to tone down the white with white weathering powders.
I really need to pause on building and clean off my desks.
Beautiful modeling Bob. I'm lucky that I have a folding table that I place build parts on when doing something large.
Wow, that must have been a scary moment as the building slid off the base. I wonder if you lightly sanded the gloss paint, if that would be enough to get better glue adhesion.
dave
Looking really great, Bob.
Your creation has very pleasing dimensions. I really like the way the corrugated iron came up.
Cheers, Mark.
It looks like everything is going to stick to the base, so I can do the wiring. I needed to have the underside flat, so I made four holding jigs out of scrap 2x4s and some plywood strips. So, so thankful that I had purchased a brad nailer as it made short work of assembly.
I used the copper tape and established the + and - strips. The 0402 LEDs are rated at three volts and came with resistors (687 ohm units) for operation at 9 to 14 volts. I can attest that the teeny little things put out a loud pop when exposed to 9 volts. Four circuits, four resistors, not three you idiot.
In this case, I added the resistors first, then added the fine wire to the ends. This wire doesn't like to take a tinning, so some solder joints look nasty. Here I decided to feed the 12 volt power from the middle as it was more convenient. The hook up wire comes in a spool box that I labeled with my wiring codes as I can forget the off colors. The cut off and wire stripper was a cheap unit and works flawlessly.
Once all joints have been completed, I like to use some hot glue to hold the wires in place, in the off chance that one could get snagged during handling. It looks ugly, but it does work.
I can't wait to see it lighted.
Went to hook up the lights and found I forgot all about one, so back upside down to hook those up.
Test lighting went as expected. With one exception. The office windows got a matte spray by accident, so basically one can't see all the interior details. Oh well.
Now I can add the details and weather this sucker.
Very nice Bob.
I did some light weathering, for now, and added some bits and bobs. I have planned where the tracks will be installed and road surface applied. But those items will have to wait until it gets installed.