Time to write up the construction of four boxcab electrics I had built several years ago. These were built to compliment the Diesel Boxcabs I wrote up in the following link:
https://modelersforum.com/index.php?topic=6790.0 (https://modelersforum.com/index.php?topic=6790.0)
One of my modeling interests is in electric engines powered from overhead wires. I have several large main line engines from commercial manufactures. Nobody makes small four wheeled electric boxcabs so I had to scratchbuild them out of brass of course. One of my favorite building materials.
So to start off, a search on the net to get an idea of what's out there. I did a search for quarry electric engines and came up with the following pics. These were the closest that I had in mind.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/boxcabelectric1.jpg)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/boxcabelectric2.jpg)
Next problem, was I going to build a DYI powered chassis or buy one. After looking at what was available in HOn30 (N gauge track width actually) I came up with these Kato 11-103. I didn't like what was available in a two truck design in HOn30, that's why the two axle unit was picked.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab1A.jpg)
Now I needed to come up with a properly designed boxcab. I paper mock up was drafted in CAD, applied to some cardboard for the mock up, but first I needed to make a floor to fit on the chassis.
Using a piece of .030" thick brass I used a CAD drawing to cut out the base using a fret saw with a fine tooth metal saw blade.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab1.jpg)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab2.jpg)
To fit properly I had to removed two tabs for the floor to fit over the motor.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab3.jpg)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab4.jpg)
Next the body mockup.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab7.jpg)
Next I'll get into the sides that were cutout on the Sherline CNC.
Bernd
Bernd great photos of the electrics and especially the first photo. I see you're using a Kato drive so I assume you're going with HOn3 scale for the boxcab. I purchased a Kato 11-109 awhile back and it runs flawlessly for a On18 critter. Good luck with this and I'll stop in and see how you're progressing.
Quote from: Larry C on March 12, 2026, 07:38:02 PMBernd great photos of the electrics and especially the first photo. I see you're using a Kato drive so I assume you're going with HOn3 scale for the boxcab. I purchased a Kato 11-109 awhile back and it runs flawlessly for a On18 critter. Good luck with this and I'll stop in and see how you're progressing.
Thanks Larry. I went back and checked when I actually started these. It was ten years ago. They aren't finished yet. They still need a few details and paint. Since I've started work on the brass quarry cars the engines have taken a back seat so to speak.
I believe the Kato 11-109 is the newer version of the 11-103. They do run flawlessly. Can you imagine doing a brass one in On18? I can. but I'm staying away from the O scale (for now ;) )
Bernd
Quote from: Bernd on March 13, 2026, 08:54:38 AMI believe the Kato 11-109 is the newer version of the 11-103. They do run flawlessly. Can you imagine doing a brass one in On18? I can. but I'm staying away from the O scale (for now ;) )
Bernd
If you can do brass in On18 you're a better modeler than I am. Don't be afraid to be lured to the "dark side" of model railroading.
Quote from: Larry C on March 13, 2026, 02:59:14 PMQuote from: Bernd on March 13, 2026, 08:54:38 AMI believe the Kato 11-109 is the newer version of the 11-103. They do run flawlessly. Can you imagine doing a brass one in On18? I can. but I'm staying away from the O scale (for now ;) )
Bernd
If you can do brass in On18 you're a better modeler than I am. Don't be afraid to be lured to the "dark side" of model railroading.
I was into On30 back about 10 years ago along with TT scale and live steam. I figured I better settle on one scale if I wanted to get anything done. But perhaps for a side interest I might try it some time when I get bored with HO. :o ;)
Bernd
Bernd,
Making anything smaller than HO scale is beyond my train of thought, HO is small enough for me.
Like I mentioned in your other thread, its fun to sit back and watch you, especially running all
of your milling machines. I wonder after seeing your mock-up above, if I can follow along to make
a similar piece of powered rolling stock with one of the self-powered Tenshodo Ho Gauge Coreless
Power Trucks WB 24.5-10.5? All I have to do is make a floor (maybe out of wood), and add the wood
sidewalls, similar to your mock-up. I'm thinking on the lines of a small climax, vertical boiler
engine. Thanks for the inspiration. I may try it!
Rich
Quote from: Pennman on March 14, 2026, 12:10:15 AMBernd,
Making anything smaller than HO scale is beyond my train of thought, HO is small enough for me.
Like I mentioned in your other thread, its fun to sit back and watch you, especially running all
of your milling machines. I wonder after seeing your mock-up above, if I can follow along to make
a similar piece of powered rolling stock with one of the self-powered Tenshodo Ho Gauge Coreless
Power Trucks WB 24.5-10.5? All I have to do is make a floor (maybe out of wood), and add the wood
sidewalls, similar to your mock-up. I'm thinking on the lines of a small climax, vertical boiler
engine. Thanks for the inspiration. I may try it!
Rich
Thanks Rich. HOn30 is not smaller in scale size, it's smaller in track width or track gauge.
Yes, you can make it out of wood. Material doesn't matter.
Lets see what you can come up with.
Bernd
Ok, moving on to the shell or body of the boxcab.
Below are two drawings, one labeled CAD and one CNC version. The CAD file is then exported as a DXF file into the CAM program. The CAD version has all the lines that will be needed in the CAM (computer aided machining) to set up telling the machine what line to cut, whether to cut inside the line or outside the line, how deep and how many passes it needs to make to step down to the next amount of stock to remove so the machine can cut out the part to proper size. Note the little black boxes connecting the door, windows and louvers. The machine is told to leave this part uncut so when the cutter breaks through the bottom the little waste piece doesn't tangled in the cutter and breaks the cutter or wings it across the room.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab11.jpg)
Here are the first two sides cut out. Note the stock left to hold the parts in place.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab13.jpg)
I had cut out the first floor manually to get the dimensions needed to draw it up in CAD and then proceeded like I did for the sides. Makes for better fit and straight line cuts and square corners.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab8.jpg)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab9.jpg)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab10.jpg)
After cutting out the parts from the main sheet and some filing to clean up the edges. This is what you wind up with.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab12.jpg)
That's it for now. Next I'll get into assembly of the basic shell.
Bernd
Great work Bernd, now all I have to do is get to my drafting board!
Rich
Thanks Rich.
Kind of tough to covert those drafting plans into CAM. ;D
Bernd
8) Some have all the cool tools. ;)
Quote from: Philip on March 16, 2026, 10:04:39 AM8) Some have all the cool tools. ;)
You could own some of those cool tools also.
A basic milling machines is a fair amount of space and $$. I'm not sure I could find a shop nearby that would do that job on the clock these days. So a friend who's a machinist...
Quote from: Bernd on March 16, 2026, 10:15:23 AMQuote from: Philip on March 16, 2026, 10:04:39 AM8) Some have all the cool tools. ;)
You could own some of those cool tools also.
The cost (for me) to learn to USE those cool tools would exceed the cost of the tools!
James, the Portsmouth Makerspace has a Bridgeport.
dave
Quote from: jbvb on March 16, 2026, 11:18:36 AMA basic milling machines is a fair amount of space and $$. I'm not sure I could find a shop nearby that would do that job on the clock these days. So a friend who's a machinist...
The Sherline doesn't take up much space. Mine sits on a bench that's 2' X 4' and includes the computer and screen. The Grizzly mini-mill and Sherline lathe sit on another bench the same size taking up a total area of 4'X 8' with a 2' 4" X 4' aisle between the two benches. A total of 4' X 8' for three machines. Time to learn how to use them? Depends on your natural abilities in mechanical things. Price? Expensive? Not when compared to the industrial machine used to make bigger parts. I figure if you have a dozen full blown DCC engines you've already spent the money compared to what a Sherline CNC mill would cost.
Bernd
Bernd
Bernd exceptional work!!
Learning CAD then the machines would take a lot of time. Glad you mastered them and put that knowledge to good use.
Jerry
On to more brass bashing.
Here the machine is cutting out the boxcab ends. I show four being cutout but will need eight total for front and back.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab14.jpg)
The first four cutout and ready to be released from waste brass.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab15.jpg)
Next a pocket .020" deep was cut into a piece of 6160.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab16.jpg)
The part was clamped down, the head swung to 45° to mill a 45° angle on the edge of the sides and ends for a better fit when soldering them together.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab17.jpg)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab18.jpg)
Not all works out well all the time. Occasionally the machine get hungry and eats a piece. No problem, another gets cut out. That's what's so great about CNC machining. A quick set up and call up the part program and cut away.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab22.jpg)
Once all the parts have been prepared it's time for some assembly. I'm using my DYI resistance soldering rig to solder the sides together while being held in a 90° soldering fixture.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab19.jpg)
The end result.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab20.jpg)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab21.jpg)
That's it for now. Next I'll show how I made the louvers to fill the upper square openings.
Bernd
Bernd,
Absolutely fantastic modeling and expertly done sir. Very professional.
Tom
Quote from: Jerry on March 16, 2026, 05:12:36 PMBernd exceptional work!!
Learning CAD then the machines would take a lot of time. Glad you mastered them and put that knowledge to good use.
Jerry
Thanks Jerry, appreciate the kind words.
Anybody can learn CAD. Much easier when younger, but it's learnable. I started out with a friends pirated AutoCad 10 on a DYI parts assembled Intel 80286 chip DOS computer many years ago. It's no different than learning to assemble a kit and weather it. It takes practice, then more practice and then a little bit more practice.
My main purpose of showing this is that some younger person interested in model railroading will try this instead of asking where can I find a file to 3D print this engine. The Star Trek replicator has not been invented yet and probably never will.
Bernd
Quote from: ACL1504 on March 16, 2026, 05:21:03 PMBernd,
Absolutely fantastic modeling and expertly done sir. Very professional.
Tom
Thank you very much Tom.
Bernd
On to doing the louvers. If I remember correctly I first cut slots. Then I tilted the head 45° to cut the angle on the individual pieces.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab23.jpg)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab24.jpg)
The angled strips where then soldered onto a piece of thin sheet brass and cut to size to fit the openings in the shell.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab25.jpg)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab26.JPG)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab28.JPG)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab29.jpg)
The bottom openings had wire mesh solder in.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab32.jpg)
That's it for today. A short posting. Up next will be making the roof panels.
Bernd
On to making the roof.
I machined arches to shape the curvature of the roof.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab33.jpg)
Long stringers were cut to fit the length of the roof line. Notches where also cut into the curved sections for easy line up.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab34.jpg)
The middle three stringers were solder in place and then checked for fit in the shell.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab35.jpg)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab36.jpg)
Next I flatten a piece of solder to measure the width of the roof. That's Ted the Wood Chopper helping out with trimming the solder.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab37.jpg)
To solder the outside stringers on I use some tinfoil folded over the side of the shell so the stringer wouldn't get soldered to the shell side.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab38.jpg)
The shell was clamped to a jig plate for soldering with the resistance soldering rig.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab39.jpg)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab40.jpg)
Next the roof size was printed on a piece of paper and glued to a piece of .010" brass and cut out with a pair of scissors.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab41.jpg)
Once the pieces were cut out they were rolled over two pieces of copper tubing, the second tubing being smaller in diameter to get the roof curved close to the curvature of the roof line.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab42.jpg)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab43.jpg)
Once the curvature was close the brass sheet was secured with soft wire. The wood is to keep the wire from denting the edge of the roof side overhang.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab44.jpg)
The stringers and brass sheet were then soldered together.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab45.jpg)
The end result. A nice clean fitting roof.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab46.jpg)
And while I was at it. I milled out some doors. They represent a sliding door on the engine.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab48.jpg)
That's it for now. Next I'll get into the nitty gritty of the pantographs. (Pants up)
Bernd
Nice updates and great overall tutorial.
Now I can see how this goes together, I can start making my pieces from wood, since
you showed me all of the sides. Not bad for you either, but you only have 66 more to build?
Or was that quarry cars that you were making 70?
Rich
That's old-school craftsmanship, particularly on the roof.
dave
Quote from: Pennman on March 18, 2026, 09:49:41 PMNice updates and great overall tutorial.
Now I can see how this goes together, I can start making my pieces from wood, since
you showed me all of the sides. Not bad for you either, but you only have 66 more to build?
Or was that quarry cars that you were making 70?
Rich
Thanks Rich. That's what I show is the construction and not what materials to use. Doesn't mean you can't use wood or plastic. The material used is "immaterial" to the end product. Glad you got something out of this.
Bernd
Quote from: deemery on March 19, 2026, 08:59:36 AMThat's old-school craftsmanship, particularly on the roof.
dave
Isn't it amazing how how school craftsmanship can be applied to modern day building of models from raw materials. And I'm only 5 years older than you.
Bernd
Quote from: Bernd on March 19, 2026, 09:11:28 AMQuote from: deemery on March 19, 2026, 08:59:36 AMThat's old-school craftsmanship, particularly on the roof.
dave
Isn't it amazing how how school craftsmanship can be applied to modern day building of models from raw materials. And I'm only 5 years older than you.
Bernd
But a generation away from me in experience! I do remember junior high wood shop, but no practical education past that, except for my exposure to computers/programmable desktop calculators in high school. There's a saying, "The most dangerous thing in IT is a software guy with a soldering iron." That would be me. ;D
dave
Quote from: deemery on March 19, 2026, 09:19:26 AMQuote from: Bernd on March 19, 2026, 09:11:28 AMQuote from: deemery on March 19, 2026, 08:59:36 AMThat's old-school craftsmanship, particularly on the roof.
dave
Isn't it amazing how how school craftsmanship can be applied to modern day building of models from raw materials. And I'm only 5 years older than you.
Bernd
But a generation away from me in experience! I do remember junior high wood shop, but no practical education past that, except for my exposure to computers/programmable desktop calculators in high school. There's a saying, "The most dangerous thing in IT is a software guy with a soldering iron." That would be me. ;D
dave
That's funny Dave. I was mulling over my interest in Model Railroading this morning and I think I may have figured out why I turned to model railroading as a hobby. One thing is it has a diversity of subjects. It includes lots of disciplines that not to many other hobby's have.
I have to thank my Dad for my love of things mechanical. Dad built model sailplanes in his younger years. He also liked building live steam engine models and install them in scratch built/kit built model boats with radio control. Together we built the radio control kit's by Heathkit and flew planes with those assembled radio control kits. There never was any other subjects talked about such as sports, music or other things parents try to get their kids interested in. From those experiences I got into electronics and computers and other interesting subjects. For me things like what I do comes to me naturally. I guess you can call it natural ability. Some people you can give a wrench to and they will have not idea what it is or how to use. Other's know exactly what it's used for and can use it without being taught .
Ok, back to building the electric box cabs.
Bernd
On to building the pantographs.
I started out by comparing a couple of pantographs I had from other models to see what would work. The first I tried is an "N scale" pantograph. A little to small.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab49.jpg)
This next one, is I believe, a Walthers one from a long time ago. Looks a little to big.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab50.jpg)
A little comparison to the one that inspired this build. Close but no cigar. Still seemed a little to large.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab51.jpg)
A comparison with a "Little Joe".
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab52.jpg)
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab53.jpg)
How about next to a Great Northern Z-1? Still seems a little to big.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab54.jpg)
Let's see what it would look like next to the HOn30 diesel. Boxcab looks a bit big compared to the little diesel.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab55.jpg)
How about a group photograph?
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab56.jpg)
Can't tell much there.
Ok, time to look a building one that's just right. Bob Hegge had an article back in the 60's or 70's on building an electric motor for his O scale Crooked Mountain Line. Excellent article for those who like electrics.
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/elecboxcab57.jpg)
Ok, so what's the anatomy of a pantograph?
(https://www.kingstonemodelworks.com/HOn30Boxcab/PantsISO002.jpg)
Oh WOW. Lot's of anatomy there.
That's it for now. I the next post I'll get into the building of the pantograph.
Bernd