The HOn3 Grizzly & Dilapidated Ry. - A new take on the GORRE & DAPHETID Ry.

kyle creel · April 19, 2025, 05:59:22 PM

OK- Here we go ;

I'm currently building (60% along) an On30 layout called The Grizzly & Dilapidated Ry. This is the 7th incarnation of what started back in 2012 as a 'prove it can be done in On30' version of John Allens' HO scale Gorre & Daphetid Ry.; in it's 4x8 rendition in "101 Track Plans". I was determined to have 18" minimum radius curves, and by using a 4% grade around to the second level 'crossover bridge above Gorre, and a 5% grade up to Daphetid. I did this by 'cantilevering' the uphill approach at the point where it could follow 'above' the lower track and curve around the corner to still exit through the 'inside tunnel' leading to the 'iconic stone arch/wooden Warren Truss Bridge. Somehow I was able to accomplish this and I'll show how I did it in the track plan below. The layout "expanded" (as is usually the case) and morphed into a mid-sized to semi large layout in all it's versions; with the one exception of an apartment sized 4x9 simple loop version 2 years ago for the NMRA National Convention here in DFW in 2023.

That brings us to my current 'predicament'; feeling the steady 'nibble' of the "you could build THIS and it would be sooooo cool" BUG

. I've been seeing some very enticing HOn3 layouts, but everybody does the same thing... "smaller scale-MORE LAYOUT" in the room, which inevitibly leads to a huge undertaking.

Then it hit me;

- could I do a version of the G&D that's smaller than 4X8 (even if just by a bit), have 18" minimum radius, 4% grades (no 5%), and a way to turn locomotives at Dilapidated, without totally brutalizing the original idea and "feel" of John Allens' marvelous creation. If I could; it might be worth a try.

So, I sat down and started working on the size first. I went from 6'9" X 3'8" down to 6'6" by 3'6". Believe it or not that turned out to be a big difference. At first I didn't see a way forward. Then it hit me

!!!!!!!!!

Since I was already going to use a "Sector Plate" idea from my current project, (to turn locomotives at Dilapidated) that part would be no problem; next - why not modify the "Stone Arch/Warren Truss Bridge" to enable the track work to 'flow' thru Grizzly and keep to the 18" minimum radius stipulation.

I got out the compass and scale ruler and spent 4 hours happily (I love this stuff) drawing away till I had come up with a workable plan. No curved turnouts, no shortcuts, a way to turn locomotives at Dilapidated; and only the 'modification' of the bridge over Grizzly

. The track plan is below.....

SO, do I 'wind up' the On30 layout (I consider my layouts to be DONE; not completed or'finished', but only 'what if' stuff left to do) and at 71 be content with a nice layout that's enjoyable and not hard to maintain; or stop work, change scales, sell my On30 stuff, move over to HOn3, and build the HOn3 G&D Ry. layout described above that I know I could take with me if the need arises. (The On30 layout would "have to go" in that eventuality; whether or not I built the HOn3 project).

I'm leaning towards having 'both'(inspiration courtesy Larry C.) since I could build the HOn3 out of pink foam, and use little or no plaster on the scenery to make it as light as possible. It would be an interesting delve into carving pink foam and applying texture paint. Guess I've got myself into a pickle....

.

Let me know what ya'll think, I hope I didn't take too much time and space.......
KYLE CREEL
G&D Ry.

This is how I did the 'cantilever idea.......

This is how it 'turned out'..............
Picture 024.jpg

This is part of the current project.......

This is the proposed project; the sector plate is in the upper left corner and the "bridge modifications" should be apparent.......

I know it looks "roundy roundy" but actually it's POINT TO POINT. Trains leave Grizzly heading east (right) go up and around to the left side of the layout; exit the inside tunnel portal and over "the bridge" to Peau Dunque Jct. then proceed past the first turnout (goes back to Grizzly) and take the left diverging track at the second turnout to go to Dilapidated. Drop the consist at the depot, work the mine, turn the locomotive on the sector plate and take the consist back to Grizzly via the same route, only in the opposite direction. You can still run trains 'round 'n round' via the cutoff at Peau Dunque Jct. when train watching is the order of the day.....

Comments and suggestions welcomed...........
Thanx,
KYLE

cuse · April 20, 2025, 10:44:49 AM

I like it Kyle...that original G&D plan is brilliant, in my opinion...it's one you can quickly discount as "roundy round" and then keep coming back to and finding genius, then trashing it as "busy like a bowl of spaghetti", then see the multi-level scenic possibilities, then...

I like the point to point mentality, but I also can't imagine not being able to just let em run.

I'm here for it...

John

GPdemayo · April 20, 2025, 02:58:16 PM

Looks like you have a winner here Kyle, your plan looks to loaded with interesting scene possibilities.....

kyle creel · April 20, 2025, 07:49:14 PM

Thanx John, and thanx Greg;

Here's a twist...

Cut the pink foam base down to 6'-6"x 3'-6" just as in the other plan. Now cut it diagonally @ a 100 degree angle to make each section a matching trapezoid, one parallel side is 3'-6" the opposite side is 3'; each section is exactly the same width-3'-6" (42"). Now slide one section over 4-1/2" to create an "offset alignment"....a sort of 'zig-zag' appearance.

This shortens the layout by 1", but gives it a totally new dimension in look and track arrangement possibilities. This also is very strange looking to the viewer, who is thinking what happened to the 'loopty-loop'....

?

This arrangement, sort of a 'peanut shaped plan, at first glance looks 'roundy-roundy'...sorta..but something's "off"

. There's 3 track portal entrances on the right and only ONE one the left ?? (the return track portal exit to Grizzly is 'cleverly hidden'

? on the lower left side) The center track on the right is left unkempt and slightly overgrown to imply very little use. This is the return (roundy-roundy) track to Grizzly.

I came up with this idea last year for an On30 project. I went a different route, but kept the thing in my head for 'what ifs'.

This Version has a mine (not coal) up in Dilapidated; a gas or oil well head in Peau Dunque Jct.; and it interchanges freight with the D&RGW via..

the 'CLEVERLY HIDDEN' return track exiting the lower left tunnel portal.

I've moved the TT and engine facilities to the right side. This sorta balances out the overall appearance, I think. I did leave the yard and freight/interchange house on the left side. I think it looks OK there. There's also a stream or creek meandering its' way down from "The Dilapidated Cliffs" into and through Grizzly. Lots of spruce, pine and other tall trees will also 'grace the landscape; but it will have a very 'rugged overall appearance' and 'feel' via the geology and terrain.

I'm slowly talking myself into...................

So here it is....

Whadda ya think?

KYLE CREEL
G&D Ry.

kyle creel · April 27, 2025, 01:05:50 PM

OK-I'm back with another rendition of of my G&D Ry. in HOn3. This version is done to include something I've not seen done before; in HO, HOn3, or On30. This plan has the same measurements....6'-6" x 3'-6". It does however include a staging track on the 'lower level' with a siding for a locomotive (& tender) up to 12" long. This gives the opertator a way to bring trains onto the layout via the interchange trackage @ GRIZZLY and PEAU DUNQUE JCT. This feature can also be used as a passing siding when doing 2 train continous or 'loop' running. The grades are still all 4% and the minium radius is still 18"- 20". All turnouts are #5 or #6. There is still a 10" Turntable in GRIZZLY and a 10" sector plate in DILAPIDATED for 'point to point' operations.

I believe I'm going to (with Mgt. approval) start building it this winter or next spring- if I can 'finish up' the On30 G&D Ry. layout this summer. The On30 layout will never be COMPLETELY DONE as they say, but the fun is in the doing. This fall I'll get back to work on the O scale 2 rail switching layout, "on a 28x80 door" that's waiting on me in the garage. I have 3 locos and 6 pieces of rolling stock, so it'll be 'good to go'...............

Am I too deep in trains

?

KYLE CREEL
G&D Ry.

Here's the latest version....."Lower level".......
Red arrows show the staging track & siding; Black arrows are staging track clearance limits, Green arrows are the D&GRW interchanges @ GRIZZLY & PEAU DUNQUE JCT......

Here's the "main level"........

I hope it's not too convoluted and/or confusing, I think it'll be a lot of fun to build and run trains on.
I won't have to have a whole "stable" of locomotives either, I think I'll be fine with a K27, a Mogul, and a C-16. There are some deals out there if you look, and are prudent. K27s go for around $400 - $600, and the others a little less. I'll take my time and shop..........

Thanx again for stoppin by and ya'll stay tuned......

Larry C · May 01, 2025, 08:28:23 AM

Kyle you certainly have been a busy little beaver!! The track plan concept looks great and should provide some nice running and switching possibilities. I'm pleased to have inspired you through my modeling and hope you enjoy this new venture.

kyle creel · May 09, 2025, 04:05:11 PM

Thanx Larry C.;

I decided to try one more track plan; this time in only a 3'x 6' format. This'll be a point to point/continous plan also. It's an oval with a 'semi-concealed' cutoff turnout that sends the main line up to the 'higher level' via a WS 12' 3% grade incline set. All turnouts and the wye are #4, and the min. radius is 16".

The reason for the different plan is I have already done a 'G&D' "copy/version" (in On30), so why not try a different 'tried 'n true' (somebody's done it before) idea for my HOn3 project. I also like the size. If I make all the elements of the rock formations that rise above the 4-1/2" elevation out of pink foam and texture paint or Sculptamold, they can be removable- allowing the RR to be stored vertically on its' 6' side in my 'train room' and not need any 'extra area'. It also 'fits' on top of the 'murphy bed' when it's folded down/out; no legs needed. I still have the framework I built for the 'Apartment Layout' if I want to move it to another room for photos or whatever. The frame is 2'x 5'; and supported a layout that's 4'x 6'. This size layout is also good for any 'future developements' that require a 'relocation to smaller surroundings'

All this will have to wait awhile till my left arm gets to feeling better. I ruptured my left bicep muscle

while moving a piece of furniture last Friday. (May 2nd) I completely tore it lose from the bone in my elbow. It hurt 'like a son of a bitch'; and it looked like there was a 'hole in my arm' just below the bottom of my bicep. I went to the doctor on Tuesday and my doctor said that at my age-71- he won't "do a damn thing about it".

He said " if you were 25 and playing football or something; you'd need and get surgery"; "but with your heart condition and age, it's not worth it. "You'll get more movement and use out of the arm as time passes, a couple of months or so; but surgery is not an option." "The sorness and pain will subside in about a week or two, so buy and wear a 'support sleeve' to help it 'get better', and for when you need some extra support." "Congratulations on losing 20 lbs." "No, it won't 'grow back' and 're-attach itself."

That's about all for now......thanx for stoppin by, and stay tuned.......

KYLE CREEL
GOODE-FOOTE RR Co.
The plan.........

jbvb · May 09, 2025, 06:41:45 PM

Beware: the turnout connecting the oval to the branch to the upper level is drawn as one continuous radius. It could be done handlaid but if you add two inches of straight track and put the vertex bend (where the diverging stock rail is bent so the points can seat and not get picked) at the midpoint, it will operate better.

kyle creel · May 10, 2025, 01:51:41 AM

Thanx James; You are correct. My apologies; I didn't draw the section of track in question very accurately. You are talking about the turnout at the top of the layout above (in the drawing) the turntable where the main line continues around and exits the tunnel as it climbs up to the upper part, right? The turnout in question will be slightly further to the left (not like in the track plan) and be located roughly in the middle of a 10" section of straight track. It'll have about 2" of straight track before the turnout, appx. 7" of turnout, and all straight track till the continous loop exits the tunnel portal in the upper left of the track plan. I thank you for your comment and suggestion, hope you liked the design...

Ya'll let me know what ya think

KYLE CREEL
GOODE FOOTE RR Co.

The green line shows the length of straight track, so the turnout will work properly. The yellow line 'marks out' where I 'messed up' the drawing.....

Thanx again...................

Larry C · May 10, 2025, 09:44:06 AM

Kyle that sucks about the torn bicep....mine hurts just thinking about it.Hope it heals, as much as it can, quickly and BE CAREFUL when doing stuff. Better to ask for help than trying doing it all yourself and end up not being able to do anything; just one old fart to another.

jbvb · May 10, 2025, 12:28:15 PM

Yes Kyle, that looks better. I'm not up to date on your thread so I wasn't sure how you will do the track. Stunts can be done with strategically placed guardrails but better if the plan is adjusted before the roadbed is built.