Painting A Brass Locomotive for Erieman

[ACL1504]

What a wonderful paint job. Sorry for all the problems that this engine came with. I guess the next time I buy any brass, I know to call you first. Really looking forward to see this beautiful engine running on the railroad. Who know, I might find another engine just like this one with good rods. Thank you for all you wonderful work. I'd buy you a drink in Boston, but neither of us drink. Maybe we will find an interesting structure. Again, thank you for all your wonderful work and looking forward to seeing you and your buddies at the Expo.

Safe travels.

Frank / Erieman

Frank,

Even with all the issues, I thoroughly enjoyed the project. As I said, if nothing else, it looks good. And, you are very welcome and I think we are all looking forward to the EXPO!


Tom

[jbvb]

It should be possible to drill the rod bearings out and bush them, which would be less trouble than making new rods.  Might require lathe work to make the new bushings if standard tube sizes wouldn't give you a usable O.D.

[bparrish]

Tom ...

Depending on the available wall thickness of the side rods, consider this. Find a brass rod or tubing that has as OD enough to stuff up the hole.  The ID is not important yet.  This works really well with solid rod.  Then open the worn side rod to something less than the bar stock. A minus 1 fit should be enough.  Then press in the bar stock or flash solder it in. Dress down both sides to flat to the side rods. 

Now here is the trick part.  Take a vernier caliper and measure the space over the two axles that the side rod will finish up on.  Then subtract ONE axle diameter and you will have the exact centers of the axles.  That then becomes the center to center for the rod openings.

Mark out the location and drill out the ID for the wheel screw.  Can't miss.

I never get too alarmed by the brass bushing in the rod as many manufacturers used coined brass for the rods and plated them for the appearance of steel.  If you want to have an unlike material for the bushing then pick what ever material as the insert material.

Let me know if this is not clear. 

See ya
Bob

[RWL]

I imagine we will soon be reading how Tom mastered Bob's technique of bushing the out of round rods.

Bob

[ACL1504]

It should be possible to drill the rod bearings out and bush them, which would be less trouble than making new rods.  Might require lathe work to make the new bushings if standard tube sizes wouldn't give you a usable O.D.

James,

Way beyond my expertise. However, the challenge does challenge me a bit. Although I don't have a lathe.

Tom

[ACL1504]

Tom ...

Depending on the available wall thickness of the side rods, consider this. Find a brass rod or tubing that has as OD enough to stuff up the hole.  The ID is not important yet.  This works really well with solid rod.  Then open the worn side rod to something less than the bar stock. A minus 1 fit should be enough.  Then press in the bar stock or flash solder it in. Dress down both sides to flat to the side rods. 

Now here is the trick part.  Take a vernier caliper and measure the space over the two axles that the side rod will finish up on.  Then subtract ONE axle diameter and you will have the exact centers of the axles.  That then becomes the center to center for the rod openings.

Mark out the location and drill out the ID for the wheel screw.  Can't miss.

I never get too alarmed by the brass bushing in the rod as many manufacturers used coined brass for the rods and plated them for the appearance of steel.  If you want to have an unlike material for the bushing then pick what ever material as the insert material.

Let me know if this is not clear. 

See ya
Bob

Bob,

What you said makes perfect sense. It can be done but not by me. I don't have the time or the equipment to try this one.

Should I send you the loco?  Ha.

Thanks for the information.

Tom

[ACL1504]

I imagine we will soon be reading how Tom mastered Bob's technique of bushing the out of round rods.

Bob

Bob,

I appreciate the confidence you have in me on this one. However, you won't be reading it from me. At least not in this life time.

Tom

[Erieman]

Tom ...

Depending on the available wall thickness of the side rods, consider this. Find a brass rod or tubing that has as OD enough to stuff up the hole.  The ID is not important yet.  This works really well with solid rod.  Then open the worn side rod to something less than the bar stock. A minus 1 fit should be enough.  Then press in the bar stock or flash solder it in. Dress down both sides to flat to the side rods. 

Now here is the trick part.  Take a vernier caliper and measure the space over the two axles that the side rod will finish up on.  Then subtract ONE axle diameter and you will have the exact centers of the axles.  That then becomes the center to center for the rod openings.

Mark out the location and drill out the ID for the wheel screw.  Can't miss.

I never get too alarmed by the brass bushing in the rod as many manufacturers used coined brass for the rods and plated them for the appearance of steel.  If you want to have an unlike material for the bushing then pick what ever material as the insert material.

Let me know if this is not clear. 

See ya
Bob

Bob,

What you said makes perfect sense. It can be done but not by me. I don't have the time or the equipment to try this one.

Should I send you the loco? 

Tom

Good Morning Bob, Any chance I could convince you to fix this problem. As Tom mentioned, this beyond his scope and it is way beyond my scope. I would just hate to destroy the beautiful paint / detail job that Tom has done. Just asking. That's what forum friends are for.

Frank / Erieman

[ACL1504]

I second the motion to have Bob P. fix the side rods. After all we all know he loves a challenge, and an easy one for him as well.




Tom

[BandOGuy]

I second the motion to have Bob P. fix the side rods. After all we all know he loves a challenge, and an easy one for him as well.
Tom

All those in favor, say "Aye". The Chair will recognize no Nay votes.
I'm from Massachusetts and this is the way things are done in our legislature.

[bparrish]

Gents.......

Before we get too far down this road let's try one more thing that will clearly identify the problem.  In my experience the holes need to be REALLY egg shaped to have much effect.  Again...... look at how loose some manufacturers send out their products today and they run really well.

This is low rent but it will show up whether this is a problem.  Clean the hole in the side rod and use a flux liquid. Don't depend on the rosin carried in what ever solder you are using.  Then, solder the hole closed.  That's right......... fill it up. ! ! ! !

Then measure the diameter of the blind area on the crank pin screw in the wheel.  With that find a drill a few thousandths smaller than what you want.  Open the hole back up and then "walk" into the diameter you really need plus one or two thousandths.  The holes should be essentially round now.

Reassemble and oil it up with Labelle 108 or something similar.

Test it out......... Waddaya got ? ? ?

Understand that the solder material is really close to what babbit is (or was) on early side rods and journal bearings.  It is also similar to what is still in car engine bearings, although without the nickel hardening alloy.

If it is better then this is or was the problem.  If it still hunts a bit then the problem is elsewhere.  Either way there is no harm done to run this test as the solder can be removed or ignored.  Further it does not require the disassembly of the entire locomotive.

If it is better then run it ! ! !  It will take years of operation to run the side rod back egg shaped if kept lubed up.  It probably took years of running to get it out to where it was and running it dry was probably a cause. 

I tend to run my locomotives VERY dry but I don't pull long strings of cars in a continuous operation display mode as many of these old locos were used.

Let me know where it goes.

see ya
Bob

[S&S RR]

Bob


What have you got yourself into?  The solder idea is a really good idea.

[bparrish]

John.   

You're right.  I think I triggered the moose turd pie syndrome. 

See ya
Bob

[ACL1504]

John.   

You're right.  I think I triggered the moose turd pie syndrome. 

See ya
Bob

Okay,

I'll give it the old college try. I'll not do it until after the Expo. With Frank's permission that is.

Tom

[bparrish]

Allllllllllllllllllright Tom...

Thanx for letting me off the hook.  I'm not sure I want the responsibility of sending the loco through the mail.

The postal mule here in downtown Idaho could get a flat.

You'll be OK

see ya
Bob