C. C. Crow Stone Church - First Annual Raymo Build Challenge 2016

[postalkarl]

Hi John:

Looks like you have your work cut out for you. I have complete confidence that you will do well with this project. I'll be watching.

Karl

[S&S RR]

Hi John:

Looks like you have your work cut out for you. I have complete confidence that you will do well with this project. I'll be watching.

Karl

Karl


Thanks for stoping by the thread - next step the colors.

[S&S RR]

Today,  I made a few more castings. I will be ready to start playing with color combinations over the next few days. I know it will not be white - it just wouldn't look right in the area I plan on planting it on the layout.  I have a couple ideas - now if I can get them to work on the castings.

[Mark Dalrymple]

Thanks John.

I actually thought the steps looked bigger than that - but even so - try walking up steps with nearly 13" rises!  It seems to be a common problem with plaster kits.  We have 8" steps coming down to our side door - and they are really on the outside limit.  Typically the rises should be around 180mm or just over 7".  That scales out to about 2mm in Ho scale.  I don't know if there is anything you can do - but maybe it is something that manufacturers can look at?  To me it is something that I notice instantly.

Having said that - I think it is a very interesting looking kit with some fabulous detail.

Cheers, Mark.

[MAP]

Hey John, I'll be following along as well on your build.  Keep the progress photos coming!

[S&S RR]

Thanks John.

I actually thought the steps looked bigger than that - but even so - try walking up steps with nearly 13" rises!  It seems to be a common problem with plaster kits.  We have 8" steps coming down to our side door - and they are really on the outside limit.  Typically the rises should be around 180mm or just over 7".  That scales out to about 2mm in Ho scale.  I don't know if there is anything you can do - but maybe it is something that manufacturers can look at?  To me it is something that I notice instantly.

Having said that - I think it is a very interesting looking kit with some fabulous detail.

Cheers, Mark.

Mark


I agree with you completely. I just put the number out there in my post to see if anyone else was thinking the same thing.  I'm going to look at options but I think I'm locked in if I use the casting from the kit. In the location I'm placing the church on my layout,  it will not be obvious (about 48 inches from the viewer). I believe the manufacturer went for a more robust casting and pushed the limits of prototypically accurate. I'm guessing this will be a great application for the Howard Zane HWAB technique. HWAB = HIDE IT WITH A BUSH.

[S&S RR]

Hey John, I'll be following along as well on your build.  Keep the progress photos coming!

Mark


Thanks for following along.  I hope to have something to take a picture of soon!

[S&S RR]

I'm pouring castings for another build, and using the left over plaster and resign in the molds for this build,  so I will have lots of test pieces.  I really like having test pieces that are the same size and shape as the castings for the build.  It really helps me to visualize the final look to the building. Rather than posting just the final decision piece - I will be posting pictures of the tests. Good and Bad. And the details of the process I use to get there. Let's see where this takes us???

[Mark Dalrymple]

HWAB - that made me laugh!

You could try making a mold, pouring a casting, and then cutting the various steps out, and shimming their bottoms until you get the desired rises.  A bush would certainly be easier.  There may be some kits in your storage wardrobe(s)/ spare room(s) (we can all dream!) with steps you can make a casting from.

Cheers, Mark.

[bparrish]

Mark.   

The optimum measurements for steps, given to me by an old framing carpenter, is 17 1/2" for a comfortable climb.

Most any mix of that, 9 1/2 by 8, for example is good.  This is why walking up steps to a state house or Capitol building makes you take an extra step after three or four levels up. 

That's in case anyone wanted to know!!!!!

See ya
Bob

[martin.ojaste]

I built custom wooden stairs carpenter for 7 years for various types of houses and conditions. I've built 1000's of simple straight stairs to complex curved mansion staircases. There is a geometric magic combination of tread depth, run (distance from riser to riser) and rise that makes walking up them comfortable.

Some examples,

- basic basement stairs with open risers, the treads 10", runs 8.0 - 8.5",  rise 8"
- normal house stars with risers, treads 10", runs 8.25" - 8.5", rise 7.25 - 7.75"
- luxury house with risers, treads 12", runs 8.5-11", rise 7.0-7.5"
- mansions treads 12-15", runs 6-7", rise 6-7"

I found that the perfect combination is when the tread depth was big enough to fit a man's shoe climbing the stairs and a run big enough for a ladies high heel walking down the stairs without watching and being tired climbing or decending the staircase. My experience showed that,

- tread 11"
- run 9"
- rise 7 3/8"

For outside stairs, it depends on the number of rises,

- 4-6 rises, 8" rise, run 8", tread 9.5"
- 7-10 rises, 7.5" rise, run 8.25", tread 9.5"
- 10-16 rises, 7" ruse, run 8.5", tread 10"

A landing of 4+' should be after maximum of 16 rises.

This just based on my experiences and local building codes will/maybe different.

As for modeling and making our life as easy as possible,

- wooden stairs 8" tread, 8" run, 8" rise
- concrete stairs 9" tread, 9" run, 8" rise
- office building stairs 16" tread, 16" run, 6" rise
- brick stairs 13" tread, 13" run, 8" rise (based on standard brick/mortar sizes)

Note, the nosing are 0". If there are nosing add 2" to the tread, but not the run.)

I hope this helps and not confuses.

[S&S RR]

I built custom wooden stairs carpenter for 7 years for various types of houses and conditions. I've built 1000's of simple straight stairs to complex curved mansion staircases. There is a geometric magic combination of tread depth, run (distance from riser to riser) and rise that makes walking up them comfortable.

Some examples,

- basic basement stairs with open risers, the treads 10", runs 8.0 - 8.5",  rise 8"
- normal house stars with risers, treads 10", runs 8.25" - 8.5", rise 7.25 - 7.75"
- luxury house with risers, treads 12", runs 8.5-11", rise 7.0-7.5"
- mansions treads 12-15", runs 6-7", rise 6-7"

I found that the perfect combination is when the tread depth was big enough to fit a man's shoe climbing the stairs and a run big enough for a ladies high heel walking down the stairs without watching and being tired climbing or decending the staircase. My experience showed that,

- tread 11"
- run 9"
- rise 7 3/8"

For outside stairs, it depends on the number of rises,

- 4-6 rises, 8" rise, run 8", tread 9.5"
- 7-10 rises, 7.5" rise, run 8.25", tread 9.5"
- 10-16 rises, 7" ruse, run 8.5", tread 10"

A landing of 4+' should be after maximum of 16 rises.

This just based on my experiences and local building codes will/maybe different.

As for modeling and making our life as easy as possible,

- wooden stairs 8" tread, 8" run, 8" rise
- concrete stairs 9" tread, 9" run, 8" rise
- office building stairs 16" tread, 16" run, 6" rise
- brick stairs 13" tread, 13" run, 8" rise (based on standard brick/mortar sizes)

Note, the nosing are 0". If there are nosing add 2" to the tread, but not the run.)

I hope this helps and not confuses.

Marty


Custom wood stairs   Now there's a thought. Thanks for the dimensions Marty. I played around with what the stairs today.

[S&S RR]

So I recruited a couple of my little people to test the steps. Mark has a very good eye.  The steps are just about knee high for the little people. Like stepping on to the sofa I'm sitting on to type this for me.

[S&S RR]

I had the stair castings from George Sellios' Jacob's coal mounted for painting on my workbench so I set one up against the casting.


It turns out that the loading dock on George's kit is the same height as the door on the church so the casting fit.  Six steps instead of 4.

[martin.ojaste]

John, if you get brave file off the top brick layer and recarve the brick onto the new surfaces. They would be near perfect.